English Experts

[Marcio_Farias]

When I typed the following sentence on Word, its grammar checker simply suggested both "... neither grapes from thorn bushes nor..." and "... grapes from thorn bushes or..." instead.

"We do not gather grapes from thorn bushes nor figs from thistles, do we?"

Should I give Word's grammar checker credit?

[Gabi]

"Neither" alone could be used in the beginning of a sentence but when used as a conjunction it's got to go with "nor", whilst 'nor' can be used without neither =)
You should give a credit to your grammar check, I reckon =)

xx

[donay mendonça]

Complemento:

Concordo com o corretor gramatical:

not ... or / neither ...nor

We don't know or care where he is.

Neither he nor his wife eats meat.

[Marcio_Farias]

Thank you both, Gabi and donay.

Based on what you've just told me, "We do not gather grapes from thorn bushes nor figs from thistles, do we?" should have read "We gather neither grapes from thorn bushes nor figs from thistles, do we?"

Well, did I get that straight?

[donay mendonça]

Márcio,

Yes, you're correct. Or: "We don't gather grapes from thorn bushes or figs from thistles, do we?"

According to Longman:

Do not say 'neither ...or ...'. Say: not ...or .../ neither ...nor ...

I neither knew nor cared what had happened to him. - Oxford

[Marcio_Farias]

Thanks again, donay!

[Henry Cunha]

Not very good English, but this type of thing is fairly common:

How long before I get my Refund - PayPal Community
https://www.paypal-community.com/t5/Ref ... .../301232 - Cached
16 Jul 2011 – However, I do not see where the amount that they paid me “back” is credited to my PayPal account nor do I see it in my checking account. ... [Try using "or" instead of "nor" here and you lose the thread. To use "or", you'd have to revise the whole thing. The negative "I do not see" propels the writer to the use of "nor".]

Times Change: 135. Shoe-Watch
thistimethattime.blogspot.com/2011/07/135-shoe-watch.html - Cached
19 Jul 2011 – I was never in the 'shoe' business; nor do I see it happening in either near or distant future. Then what am I talking about? ...
protein powder, is protein powder healthy?, vegan protein powder ...
thefruitpursuit.com/2011/01/23/nutrition-101-protein-powder/ - Cached
[Again, that "never" leads the writer to "nor"]

23 Jan 2011 – Nor do I see it as food, God no. I see and use protein powder as a product, much like I would use salt and sugar (ok, sucanat). ...

Not exactly the King's English...

[Marcio_Farias]

H, you had me doing a lot of head scratching over this one.

So we should not see "do not... nor..." constructions as incorrect nor should we consider "neither... nor..." constructions grammatically unacceptable, right?

I think I will have to read more books and make a mental note of how writers tackle both of these forms.

Thank you for your invaluable input.

[Henry Cunha]

H, you had me doing a lot of head scratching over this one.

So we should not see "do not... nor..." constructions as incorrect nor should we consider "neither... nor..." constructions grammatically unacceptable, right?

I think I will have to read more books and make a mental note of how writers tackle both of these forms.

Thank you for your invaluable input.

On the first part of your statement (before 'nor'), strictly speaking, it's generally careless writing. Here's an example in three versions:

I should never say such things. Nor should you.
I should never say such things. Neither should you.
I should never say such things. And neither should you.

Most of us would pay little attention as to whether it's better to use 'nor' or 'neither' in the first two, but the moment you insert 'And' (as in the third), 'nor' becomes totally impracticable. What is really happening in the first one is that the speaker (or writer)uses 'nor' as a connector, instantaneously assuming (correctly) that his listener will plug in the unsaid 'neither'. It's a shortcut that doesn't affect clarity, so it's common. But almost everyone, on reflection, would probably revise the first one to read as the second.

As to the second part of your statement, I agree. 'Neither-nor' constructions are boilerplate English on anybody's book.

My tendency here is to be lenient unless I see it happening in a formal context.